Comments on: Episode 71: Pirate Special

By: Robert

Robert — Wed, 11 Jan 2012 17:25:55 +0000

I would love to see the cannonball splinter myth revisited with a properly constructed section of hull and an 18lb+ gun, preferably double shotted.

Sincerely

Robert JK
Armchair Admiral

By: Nicholas

Nicholas — Tue, 03 Jan 2012 19:32:56 +0000

I just want to join the chorus of those protesting the cannonball episode. The idea that a cannonball striking a ship cannot create lethal splintering seems grossly out-of-line with the historical record.
Please Myth Busters, redo this episode, and test more variables!

Your loyal fan,
~Nick

By: Hubert

Hubert — Thu, 08 Dec 2011 04:31:39 +0000

It all depends on what you mean by “more lethal.” Of course one man directly hit by one cannonball will be injured much more gravely than one man hit by one splinter or perhaps even by the shower of splinters from one cannonball. But the splinters are much more likely to hit you – and a bunch of other people too — because they spray out all over the place. The cannonball itself is like a single bullet that either hits you or (more likely) misses you, but the splinters are like a shotgun blast that is a lock to hit everyone in a wide area. Far more death and injury would be caused by the splinters because they would hit many more people than the cannonballs that caused them. The Mythbusters test misses the point completely. Myth Not Busted At All.

By: Jeremy

Jeremy — Thu, 08 Dec 2011 03:17:24 +0000

“If it skipped, it went over the hill.” — sage words for a missing cannonball, what eh?

By: Andrew Givens

Andrew Givens — Fri, 02 Sep 2011 23:49:40 +0000

Wow, Johnny-come-lately turns up with something to add.
As a lay, if enthusiastic, student of naval history with the prerequisite crossover taste for nerd data and big boys’ toys, I was left somewhat cold by the original ‘splinters vs cannonballs lethality’ test. I too took the view that the myriad of historically-documented casualties from heavy wooden splinters during the Napoleonic Wars showed the team’s test results to have been incorrect or at the least flawed.
But, having reviewed a few key items, I think the truth is probably closer to Adam & Jamie’s conclusion.
I say this for several reasons:
Firstly, we know about the kinds of splinter-related injuries from the days of sail and broadsides, but we must also accept that the vast majority of such documented cases occurred in fleet vs fleet combat and aboard ships of war ranging from 1st rate ships-of-the-line, down to 6th rate frigates. These were heavily-built to mediumweight ships, the largest of which featured the 12 to 18″ thick timbers mentioned by earlier posters and armed to the teeth with guns up to 32lb projectile weight, and occasionally carronades. Yes, these guns did terrific damage, that’s what happens when heavy shot hits thick timbers. The splinters were horrendous.
Secondly, the original myth was not about the effects of splinters relative to cannonball impact aboard warships; it was about the relative number of such fatalities aboard PIRATE ships. Pirates couldn’t generally afford to buy a 3rd-rate, two-decker battleship, or even a nice spanking frigate. A sloop of war would have been a push. The vast majority of ships employed by pirates were of private or mercantile origin, and their scantlings were typically much lighter than those of even small warships such as corvettes. Built to tolerate the stresses of oceanic voyage whilst carrying a cargo, the emphasis was on frame strength and economy. To meet these demands, a mercantile hull invested in a strong frame for durability but a relatively light skin for low cost and low weight & high speed. Such vessels typically only carried light guns of less than 12lb projectile weight in addition. This saved weight and cost and made procurement of ammunition easier. Also, what would a pirate ship be shooting at? A merchant victim or a rival pirate vessel would only need a light gun turned on it to punch holes in it and have the correct psychological effect. If the Royal Navy turned up in pursuit, it would be with a little brig or two, maybe a sloop. These vessels carried small guns also, for the same reasons as the pirates carried such armaments, though the navy did usually have the edge it’s true.
Finally, the myth stated that the splinters were more deadly than the cannonball. That was busted because, in the firing tests I’ve seen, it’s false! A direct hit from a 6lb shot will kill you or carry off a limb; a splinter produced by a small round against thin timbers may or may not be grievous and may well lead to infection, but has none of the lethality of either a solid shot or the splinters encountered on the heavyweight ships at Trafalgar. Totally different story. In any case, the History Channel documentary that was referenced earlier shows a sequence where a 40-odd lb shot hits heavier timbers than the Mythbusters used. The result superficially suggested that the splinters from this hit were more lethal than the solid shot; in fact the slo-mo showed the shot passing through and destroying two of the three man-size targets before the splinters even hit, and the third target (which had been declared to be “decapitated” by a splinter) sustained only superficial penetrative damage from wooden shards while its head fell of due to the shock of impact, being moulded separately to the body like a tailor’s dummy and lightly attached. In short, this demo, like Adam & Jamie’s, did not recreate the effect of fire against a galleon or ship of the line, but rather against a light, piratey target and both proved the same result: Myth Busted.
I didn’t want it to be so, but there it is.
Please guys; feel free to revisit this myth and ramp it up sometime though!

By: bobby jones

bobby jones — Sun, 14 Aug 2011 03:56:31 +0000

on the hellboy flip a jeep episode, they test with a weight smashing straight down. i think the results would be different if instead of a 90 degree hit to the front of the jeep, they hit the same spot the top of the nose of the jeep but at more of a opposing forward downward 45 degree angle. this could probably be done with a recking ball cable attached at a position behind the jeep at the point of impact swinging in a bow like motion useing the ground to stop the ball. however this may cause the jeep to flip and hit the cable that is attached to the ball. you could probably avoid that by having two crane cables one out each side of the ball instead of out the top of the ball.

By: Evan

Evan — Mon, 03 Jan 2011 17:21:58 +0000

if the mythbusters knew their history they would know that despite their test the majority of injuries suffered during battles abourd ships a few hundred years ago were from splinters, not the cannonballs themselves

By: Hefsgaard

Hefsgaard — Sun, 19 Dec 2010 12:32:19 +0000

A couple of thoughts on the Splintes myth.

Most pirates might indeed have carried small weight cannons. But the ships sent to combat pirates would be Naval ships with larger guns.

The construction of the test-shipside is proberly quite close to a lige ship such as the average pirate might use. However planks and spars would not be screwed fast but nailed with wooden pegs. Another part of the construction that missed totaly was the tar and pitch used to make it waterproof and combat rot.

The angle of penetration might produce diffrent resaults. As could hitting not one plank, but between planks, or even tilling the spar itself.

One observation that may indicate that large splinters is indeed possible can be observed when a beam of heavy wood is broken my asserting mechanical preassure. The ends produce large pointed spikes.

By: Richard

Richard — Thu, 12 Aug 2010 07:57:00 +0000

Historically there are many accounts of the damage done by splinters in naval battles. Eye-witness accounts state that it was the large slow-moving cannonballs that did the most damage. At battles like Trafalgar these would mainly be 32 or 34 pounders. However, even larger balls were fired by carronades. The carronade aboard the Victory fired a 68 pound low-velocity shot. At point blank range it would cause horrific damage.

The cannon used in Mythbusters appears to have been a rifled Civil War cannon. As a result it would have a very high muzzle velocity and pass through the simulated wooden side of the “ship” without much damage. Almost certainly a 24 or 32 pound low velocity shot would cause extensive splintering.

If Mythbusters can get hold of a larger gun or get one of their members to build one (Corrie seems quite good at doing this) they should try to replicate the experiment using a heavier cannonball fired at subsonic speeds. Most Napoleonic era guns fired such low velocity shot. I suspect they will get a different result.

The eye patch myth made no sense. Why on earth would pirates attack in the dark? The crew of a pirate ship usually vastly outnumbered the merchantmen they attacked. Attacking in the dark would throw away part of their advantage. Also on the open ocean finding another sailing ship in the dark would be next to impossible.

By: Stan

Stan — Thu, 22 Jul 2010 16:16:31 +0000

Firstly, your programme is terrific. It is interesting, amusing, and you occasionally repeat tests when questions arise – I hope you get as much pleasure doing it as I do watching.

Secondly,regarding Episode 71, which showed very little damage from wooden splinters. I think you should see an episode of “Ancient Discoveries” shown on the “History” cable channel in the U.K.
The episode is “Mega Ocean Conquest” shown on 21/07/2010. Replaying the battle of the Spanish Armada, it shows large planks devastating an area behind an oak wall when a cannonball goes through, disintegrating several dummies.
The difference may be the use of solid oak of the correct thickness.